Between being a thinker and a simpleton?

Santeira · Post time 4-8-2008 08:45 PM

Gawd, I just couldn't stop thinking like that you know--just think of it this way--if you keep on wallowing in self-pity and crying your eyes out--the pain will be amplified. And you're only gonna put the ex-bf on a freaking pedestal--a place he doesn't deserve.

I should stop thinking--really

[ Last edited by Santeira at 4-8-2008 09:05 PM ]

hamizao · Post time 4-8-2008 10:56 PM

Thanks for the clarification, Santeira. I do understand the insomnia causing thoughts/thinking. Generally my friends and I do conclude that those with tendencies towards perfectionism do experience it. Personally, I do think it's a habit we also learn in school the night before a test.....to go over or visualise mentally the subject to be tested on.

. However the difference is later it's a problem with no answer  - you get insomnia!

I do not think your dear sister is a simpleton. Crying over a broken relationship can be a good thing too......need to vent frustration and disappointment.  Perhaps you may have heard the saying "having a good cry". Yes, some people need to "mourn" the loss as only they know the "story" Some may not even find a reason to mourn as such. So would feel angry pula or just down right not worth any more thoughts about the lost relationship. It depends in the situation and the underlying factors. Overall, I like to think it as stress management once problem solving fails. But then, afterwards one needs to learn to release.

Another way, a short cut perhaps, cut your thoughts... no use to cry over spilt milk, they say. What happened has happened. So, just carry on with your life.....

[ Last edited by  hamizao at 4-8-2008 11:07 PM ]

Agul · Post time 4-8-2008 11:51 PM

Originally posted by Santeira at 4-8-2008 05:32 PM
Well, from my experience and observation, two types of idiosyncrasies--let's say between me and my sister--I think I am a thinker and I think she's a simpleton. Sometimes, I think being a thinker ...

ell, from my experience and observation, two types of idiosyncrasies--let's say between me and my sister--I think I am a thinker and I think she's a simpleton. Sometimes, I think being a thinker gives me advantage--that I have this ability to control myself from crumbling. Because I when I think, I seem to always try to find the root of the problem and it caused me temporary insomnia--made me unhappy.

It is my problem too. My issues to. You see, we are afraid to stop thinking (actually worrying) and beating ourselves up, we think that if we stop thinking, our safety will be compromised, we'll get cheated at, make wrong choice, etc... Therefore we keep holding it in mind, thinking that by constantly thinking燼bout that, we'll be protected from having the same experience again. But IMO, thats not true.

So, because my sister (whom I assumed a simpleton) doesn't think as seriously as I am (which I also assumed). When she broke up with her boyfriend she cried and wallowed in self-pity. I just broke up with my boyfriend and I didn't cry--but I couldn't stop thinking. It caused me insomnia. So at the time I opened this thread, I wasn't able to sleep and I wished I could just cry my heart out the way she did and get okay afterwards--but I realized that I couldn't--which made me want to be a simpleton like her.

So Santeira, based on what I understand, you're more on the realm of thinkingness while your sister is more of an emotioal type. Mostly the crying is expressing, and the wallowing is suppressing. Your insomnia and unability to think could be your way of coping this kind of爐rauma. Maybe you think that it will hurt you less and by rationalising it your heart will be protected. But for me it's the same as your sister. She cries because she feel upset. You can't stop thinking because you feel upset. Only your thinkingness is more of a supression (much like her wallowing, but she did express, by crying).

At every moment, we can do only four(or 3) thing, suppress, express, escape(actually a form of supression) or release. Supression is the worst. But sometime expression is inappropriate i.e. yelling at your boss.. 燬o we have one more thing, release, or drop (that emotion or thought).

We have million of thought culminating in hundreds of feelings which culminates in a few basic feeling. So we can drop the thought, or we can go directly to the feeling and drop all the thoughts underneath it. Or we can go higher to basic feelings or even higher to drop the program..

But then Mr. Agul gives me a perspective--then I should just stop thinking.

And I did and I got to sleep again. Thanks for that.

Thank you.

Most of the time we feel that it's not ok to stop thinking. If that is so, then ask ourselves, is it possible for me to stop thinking, just for this moment? And take it from that.

Agul · Post time 4-8-2008 11:56 PM

Originally posted by Santeira at 4-8-2008 08:45 PM
Gawd, I just couldn't stop thinking like that you know--just think of it this way--if you keep on wallowing in self-pity and crying your eyes out--the pain will be amplified. And you're only gonna put the ex-bf on a freaking pedestal--a place he doesn't deserve.

I should stop thinking--really

Feeling bad at any patricular person is actually taking爌oison, and hoping for them to die.

Yes, it's true that if you keep thinking about people that bothers you, you're actually putting that person in the highest place.

mbhcsf · Post time 5-8-2008 10:23 AM

what i am interested at is the way you cope with "loss" and it is not about ur thinking of your bf and what could happened, if i were u i just let him off without shedding any tears...actually ( my rationalisation - defense mechanism) so that's all.

It's the way people cope and the coping mechsinm that fascinates me- and yeas dear health or  (counselors  also )  psychologists need to explore this  "thingy " in dealing with other  'significant events'  in their patient's life. It is not just merely the " the content of your thought that matters but the way you perceive and dealing with it" could also determine the way you behave ( this is the product of the thoughts lah kira )

ever wonder why some broken hearted cases  could lead  to suicide or attempt suicide?
well, the answer is, it has a lot to do with one thinking pattern , defense mechanism etc etc ( i.e personality )

and one more thing FROM a WIDER perspective, psychiatric disorders like bereavement and grief etc will actually got a lot to do with one's coping  style  and it is  very much related to ones thinking style actually and this one is not easy as it could  some affect  on a person's  emotion. Then the emotion itself will ( affect) affect the  thinking  bit and vice versa.So how to break this  viscious cycle...? hmm ask the psychologist lah

and one more thing  about thinking style and pattern dear

NO TWO INDIVIDUALS are the same....that's what makes human the best creation ever...

and i would one to add that if u keep on thinking everyone is cheating on u etc etc then or always nak kenakan u then it is called a "freak" paranoid lah  ....that's abnormal if it being too extreme lah , hinders one interaction with others etc etc  ( READ " schizotyphiod personality , under personality disorder ) hahahhaah

[ Last edited by mbhcsf at 5-8-2008 10:27 AM ]

Santeira · Post time 5-8-2008 11:29 AM

Yes, too much thinking causes our brain to race and it was really too much for me--that caused me a sleepless night. All through my life, when something bad happens--I've always tried to rationalize things--I try to see if the root of the problem was caused by me or it is merely something my ex tried to project to me--that I was the one who caused the relationship to fail. Then later information I got revealed that he actually cheated on me. So I'm glad that I didn't shed a tear. It would be too much to waste for a man like that, eh?

Assuming my sister is a simpleton was from experiences and observation of a lifetime--sometimes I just envy her because she seems to take things easily and doesn't have to sit at one corner being quiet like I do every time I am faced with trouble or disappointment. That's what I liked--her ability to express her emotions--the way she released her emotions--I wanted to do that too. But I just couldn't--or merely refused to--because he doesn't deserve to be put on a pedestal but surely it didn't put me also in a pedestal (I am no better than my sister--each person deals with pain accordingly). It took time for me to realize but it got me to open this thread. I am fine now, however--thanks for your thoughts--it helps a lot.

[ Last edited by Santeira at 5-8-2008 11:42 AM ]

Santeira · Post time 5-8-2008 11:40 AM

It is my problem too. My issues to. You see, we are afraid to stop thinking (actually worrying) and beating ourselves up, we think that if we stop thinking, our safety will be compromised, we'll get cheated at, make wrong choice, etc... Therefore we keep holding it in mind, thinking that by constantly thinking about that, we'll be protected from having the same experience again. But IMO, thats not true.

That is sooo true. How come do you seem to have the answer to all my questions? I am glad though, it helps a lot.

So Santeira, based on what I understand, you're more on the realm of thinkingness while your sister is more of an emotioal type. Mostly the crying is expressing, and the wallowing is suppressing. Your insomnia and unability to think could be your way of coping this kind of trauma. Maybe you think that it will hurt you less and by rationalising it your heart will be protected. But for me it's the same as your sister. She cries because she feel upset. You can't stop thinking because you feel upset. Only your thinkingness is more of a supression (much like her wallowing, but she did express, by crying).

Yeah, I was upset which was why I couldn't sleep. I tried to search for answers--as to what led the breakup because I was in the dark--and I tried to think of the things that could shield my heart from breaking--that's most fitting. At some hour of the night of endless thinking--I wish I could just cry. I want to be like my sister--just cry. But I also kept thinking--if I cry--then blablablablablablablabla. I just didn't stop thinking. Maybe me, opening this thread and discussing things like this is also a form of expression--telling someone of how I felt back then. I saw her crumble and I don't want to crumble for a worthless cheat. Your solution--drop thinking by doing stuff to free the mind (not orgasm, I can't achieve that yet ahahaha) but I did yoga, prayers and meditation which helped a lot.

At every moment, we can do only four(or 3) thing, suppress, express, escape(actually a form of supression) or release. Supression is the worst. But sometime expression is inappropriate i.e. yelling at your boss.. So we have one more thing, release, or drop (that emotion or thought).

We have million of thought culminating in hundreds of feelings which culminates in a few basic feeling. So we can drop the thought, or we can go directly to the feeling and drop all the thoughts underneath it. Or we can go higher to basic feelings or even higher to drop the program..

That's really helping. Thanks a lot I say.

Thank you. Most of the time we feel that it's not ok to stop thinking. If that is so, then ask ourselves, is it possible for me to stop thinking, just for this moment? And take it from that.

I am the one who is indebted, so thanks to you. I should spend more time relaxing my mind--and I'm even trying subliminal hypnosis to just stop thinking about things. No more sleepless nights.

[ Last edited by Santeira at 5-8-2008 11:41 AM ]

Santeira · Post time 5-8-2008 11:55 AM

what i am interested at is the way you cope with "loss" and it is not about ur thinking of your bf and what could happened, if i were u i just let him off without shedding any tears...actually ( my rationalisation - defense mechanism) so that's all.

Actually I didn't cry at all, what happened was I couldn't sleep because I couldn't stop thinking. The thread was a result from me thinking too much about 'what if's and 'what-nots'. My way of dealing with the pain was to think and think. But I was upset, there's no denying that.

It's the way people cope and the coping mechsinm that fascinates me- and yeas dear health or  (counselors  also )  psychologists need to explore this  "thingy " in dealing with other  'significant events'  in their patient's life. It is not just merely the " the content of your thought that matters but the way you perceive and dealing with it" could also determine the way you behave ( this is the product of the thoughts lah kira )

ever wonder why some broken hearted cases  could lead  to suicide or attempt suicide?
well, the answer is, it has a lot to do with one thinking pattern , defense mechanism etc etc ( i.e personality )

and one more thing FROM a WIDER perspective, psychiatric disorders like bereavement and grief etc will actually got a lot to do with one's coping  style  and it is  very much related to ones thinking style actually and this one is not easy as it could  some affect  on a person's  emotion. Then the emotion itself will ( affect) affect the  thinking  bit and vice versa.So how to break this  viscious cycle...? hmm ask the psychologist lah

I'm surprised too at the way I dealt with it all. I'm glad I didn't crumble. I'm really...really glad.

and one more thing about thinking style and pattern dear

NO TWO INDIVIDUALS are the same....that's what makes human the best creation ever...

and i would one to add that if u keep on thinking everyone is cheating on u etc etc then or always nak kenakan u then it is called a "freak" paranoid lah ....that's abnormal if it being too extreme lah , hinders one interaction with others etc etc ( READ " schizotyphiod personality , under personality disorder ) hahahhaah

I'm not thinking that everyone else wants to cheat on me or anything like that.

It's just --finding someone new seems so trivial to me now. I want to spend my time for myself first. Men seem sooo insignificant to me right now.

mbhcsf · Post time 5-8-2008 03:14 PM

men well yeah they are a bit crap really...so just take them as a pinch of salts

Agul · Post time 5-8-2008 06:05 PM

Originally posted by Santeira at 5-8-2008 11:40 AM

That is sooo true. How come do you seem to have the answer to all my questions? I am glad though, it helps a lot.

Yeah, I was upset which was why I couldn't sleep. I tried to search fo ...

Probabaly because that's my problem too. No, I don't break up with a boyfriend...

hamizao · Post time 8-8-2008 11:13 PM

That's what I liked--her ability to express her emotions--the way she released her emotions--I wanted to do that too. But I just couldn't--or merely refused to--because he doesn't deserve to be put on a pedestal but surely it didn't put me also in a pedestal (I am no better than my sister--each person deals with pain accordingly).

Yeap, you got it and I hope it helps . That's why I love the book " Forgive & Forget - Healing the Hurts We Don't Deserve" by Lewis B Smedes. There are other titles of the same genre in the market. Sure we hurt, the most closest to us is usually the cause of the most hurt. The iidea is to understand and move beyond our feelings of hurt and anger. I call it the need to self preserve. That is also why we sometimes don't just trust others 100%...................to expect the unexpected , human failings..........so that it does not hurt you so much when it happens!

mbhcsf · Post time 27-8-2008 01:14 PM

if u could ask how to differentiate between them ?

my answer would be: get them to produce a write - ups on a pilot study ....
u will be surprised....a local grad here just produced 3 pages , non - formatted report with the grammar down the bin and no description on the data a telephatic profesor would be of need tapi tak pa ...the master degree will be on her way

that's a good pertinent task .....talking about apex....heheheh

[ Last edited by mbhcsf at 27-8-2008 02:08 PM ]

ajinomotonosuga · Post time 30-8-2008 01:28 AM

simpleton is a thinker in the making

thinker is a simpleton stuck in rationalisation

Agul · Post time 30-8-2008 06:27 PM

Whatever people said, thinking is in the realm of limitation.

Every thought is a limitation.

thessailly · Post time 1-9-2008 03:20 PM

Originally posted by Agul at 30-8-2008 06:27 PM
Whatever people said, thinking is in the realm of limitation.

Every thought is a limitation.

something new...

mbhcsf · Post time 3-9-2008 05:19 PM

Originally posted by ajinomotonosuga at 30-8-2008 01:28 AM
simpleton is a thinker in the making

thinker is a simpleton stuck in rationalisation

so a thinker is a simpleton, still? hmm how's that ?

hamizao · Post time 4-9-2008 10:06 PM

Basically the human mind does have limitations set by them themselves.

my-alja · Post time 5-9-2008 07:54 AM

Originally posted by mbhcsf at 3-9-2008 05:19 PM

so a thinker is a simpleton, still? hmm how's that ?

maybe it depends on the situation..
some people can be simpleton, when he buys a shirt
a thinker when he buys a computer/car

kinki · Post time 21-2-2009 09:11 PM

I am both.............a thinker and a simpleton.

it depends....

makcikmengamok · Post time 2-3-2009 06:30 AM

Originally posted by ussopp at 16-7-2008 02:44 PM
sometimes when a perfect thinker marry a simpleton is just perfect.....sometimes a disaster...

and sometimes when perfect thinker+perfect thinker or simpleton+simpleton is just perfect... ...

i disagree

a simpleton marrying a simpleton will magnify their weaknesses...

a thinker marrying a thinker...will magnify their strengths...