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I don抰 know about others..
But I抦 happy if I could help others to gain profit even if the effort makes me unhappy.
For example,
I teach students in all kind of races & social status. I punished anyone, boys or girls, to educate them. I don抰 care if the boys bigger than me. I don抰 care if their parents visit me, I don抰 care if they scratch my car. I don抰 know if what I did to them is appropriate. They r like a family...
My life with them is such a mess. But I still carry on. It抯 not only about a job or responsibility. Because deep down in my heart I know Allah is watching me. It抯 a hard life but Allah always near me (this is the important point).
Firman Allah SWT,
Bukankah Kami telah melapangkan untukmu dadamu? dan Kami telah menghilangkan daripadamu bebanmu,yang memberatkan punggungmu? Dan Kami tinggikan bagimu sebutan (nama)mu. Karena sesungguhnya sesudah kesulitan itu ada kemudahan, Sesungguhnya sesudah kesulitan itu ada kemudahan. Maka apabila kamu telah selesai (dari sesuatu urusan), kerjakanlah dengan sungguh-sungguh (urusan) yang lain dan hanya kepada Tuhanmulah hendaknya kamu berharap.
(Surah Al Insyirah :94) |
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by fleurzsa
But I抦 happy if I could help others to gain profit even if the effort makes me unhappy.
For example,
I teach students in all kind of races & social status. I punished anyone, boys or girls, to educate them. I don抰 care if the boys bigger than me. I don抰 care if their parents visit me, I don抰 care if they scratch my car. I don抰 know if what I did to them is appropriate. They r like a family...
My life with them is such a mess. But I still carry on. It抯 not only about a job or responsibility. Because deep down in my heart I know Allah is watching me. It抯 a hard life but Allah always near me (this is the important point).
Firman Allah SWT,
Bukankah Kami telah melapangkan untukmu dadamu? dan Kami telah menghilangkan daripadamu bebanmu,yang memberatkan punggungmu? Dan Kami tinggikan bagimu sebutan (nama)mu. Karena sesungguhnya sesudah kesulitan itu ada kemudahan, Sesungguhnya sesudah kesulitan itu ada kemudahan. Maka apabila kamu telah selesai (dari sesuatu urusan), kerjakanlah dengan sungguh-sungguh (urusan) yang lain dan hanya kepada Tuhanmulah hendaknya kamu berharap.
(Surah Al Insyirah :94)
Think about this question ...
IF you are commit to perform your responsibility and for sake of your God, then WHY are you not happy?
Is it because of their actions toward you?
Is it because your lessons and good will to them is not touching them?
Is it because you feel that you are putting effects to something which you could consider not worth giving effect?
IF yes to all above, then YOU ARE NOT SINCERE in your responsibility.
In B.M, anda tak bersungguh2 dan tidak menyerah. Anda sentiasa mengharapkan sesuatu dr tindakan anda ... balasan dr anak murid anda atau apa2 urusan yg lain.
Kalau anda benar2 bersungguh2 melakukan tugas anda, anda tidak akan kecewa dgn sifat orang lain termasuk anak murid sendiri. Anda akan lakukan yg terbaik utk mereka yg ingin ilmu dr andai dan samada mereka akan terima atau tidak, biarkan mereka sendiri memutuskannya.
Spt unggapan Raja dan rakyat di dalam salah satu unggapan terdahulu. Jadilah macam Raja sesuatu kerajaan. Seorang Raja tak akan tahu apa yg rakyat beliau buat, tetapi beliau tetap akan menunaikan tanggungjawab beliau dgn bersungguh2 kerana ITU yg DIHARAPKAN dr beliau.
Beliau mungkin menberikan rakyat harta dan kemewahan lebih, tetapi sekiranya ada dua tiga ekor yg kedekut dan tamak sampai sanggup merompak, adakah dosa itu Raja tanggung bersama?
Beliau mungkin menberikan perpustakaan yg terkini dgn ilmu dan guru yg bijak tetapi sekiranya ada dua tiga orang bodoh dlm kerajaan beliau, adakah dosa tersebut ditanggung oleh Raja?
Dlm ertikata lain, jangan biarkan tindakan anda bebankan diri sendiri. Jangan terlalu berkira dgn hasil usaha anda kerana ianya akan menyebabkan anda lalai dlm tanggungjawab nanti.
Dan betul apa yg ada dlm firman tu ... Mereka telah lapangkan dada mu supaya senang kamu hidup, KAMU sendiri yg penuhkannya dgn duka dan lara. Salah siapa? Tuhan? ;)
[ Last edited by Sephiroth on 8-7-2004 at 11:55 AM ] |
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Originally posted by Sephiroth at 8-7-2004 11:53 AM:
by fleurzsa
But I抦 happy if I could help others to gain profit even if the effort makes me unhappy.
For example,
I teach students in all kind of races & social status. I punished ...
This is interesting discussion but i have to go now...
Maybe u r right and maybe u r wrong... I will think about ur questions and saying, then give the answer later...
For sure.. Im not perfect but try the best I can.. |
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Good day,
Think about this question ...
IF you are commit to perform your responsibility and for sake of your God, then WHY are you not happy?
- I wasn抰 happy with the situation but I could cope it.
Is it because of their actions toward you?
- Yes. Then with my actions toward them too.
Is it because your lessons and good will to them is not touching them?
- No. I could see that sometimes they respected me in their own way.
Is it because you feel that you are putting effects to something which you could consider not worth giving effect?
- Maybe. Im sure it is a good action and I never regret it at all but this is a real world. Sometimes im strong, sometimes im tired.
IF yes to all above, then YOU ARE NOT SINCERE in your responsibility.
- Im not really cares whats ur opinion on me.
In B.M, anda tak bersungguh2 dan tidak menyerah. Anda sentiasa mengharapkan sesuatu dr tindakan anda ... balasan dr anak murid anda atau apa2 urusan yg lain.
- Mungkin saya mengharapkan sesuatu tetapi its not a big deal kalo saya tak dpt apa2 pun.
Kalau anda benar2 bersungguh2 melakukan tugas anda, anda tidak akan kecewa dgn sifat orang lain termasuk anak murid sendiri. Anda akan lakukan yg terbaik utk mereka yg ingin ilmu dr andai dan samada mereka akan terima atau tidak, biarkan mereka sendiri memutuskannya.
- Ya, ini yg selalu saya fikirkan. Tetapi kadang2 saya mengharapkan bulan jatuh ke riba ( semua perkara yg terbaik dpt dicapai)
Spt unggapan Raja dan rakyat di dalam salah satu unggapan terdahulu. Jadilah macam Raja sesuatu kerajaan. Seorang Raja tak akan tahu apa yg rakyat beliau buat, tetapi beliau tetap akan menunaikan tanggungjawab beliau dgn bersungguh2 kerana ITU yg DIHARAPKAN dr beliau.
Beliau mungkin menberikan rakyat harta dan kemewahan lebih, tetapi sekiranya ada dua tiga ekor yg kedekut dan tamak sampai sanggup merompak, adakah dosa itu Raja tanggung bersama?
Beliau mungkin menberikan perpustakaan yg terkini dgn ilmu dan guru yg bijak tetapi sekiranya ada dua tiga orang bodoh dlm kerajaan beliau, adakah dosa tersebut ditanggung oleh Raja?
- Ya, saya faham apa yg anda maksudkan.
Dlm ertikata lain, jangan biarkan tindakan anda bebankan diri sendiri. Jangan terlalu berkira dgn hasil usaha anda kerana ianya akan menyebabkan anda lalai dlm tanggungjawab nanti.
- Anda sememangnya tidak kenal saya sekiranya anda berpendapat demikian.
Dan betul apa yg ada dlm firman tu ... Mereka telah lapangkan dada mu supaya senang kamu hidup, KAMU sendiri yg penuhkannya dgn duka dan lara. Salah siapa? Tuhan?
- Ia tidak seperti apa yg anda fikirkan. Jika saya kaitkan dgn kehidupan saya:
Setiap hari saya melakukan tugas2 saya sebagai seorg Muslim. Saya bukanlah seorg yg bagus sgt, just a simple person. Saya menempuh dugaan hidup dgn hati yg redha. Ini kerana sebenarnya kesusahan yg saya hadapi dalam tugas2 saya lebih merapatkan diri saya dgn Allah. Sekali2 saya tidak menyalahkan Allah yg amat saya kasihi.
Secara dalaman saya tidak mengaggap kehidupan saya sukar kerana apabila saya mengikut segala suruhan Allah maka saya terlorong ke arah jalan yg selamat dan tenang.
Sepiroth,
Terus terang |
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[I will continue where I have left off ... there no need for summary for Jnana Yoga since it is straight forward (unlike Karma Yoga which maybe alien to some people). ]
Topic now : Yogi ... Who is Yogi according to Bhavagad Gita.
Yoga means Exercise/Mean of doing something. Yogi thus could be considered as Someone who does something. In this case, it is someone who tries to attain spiritualism (according to Hindusm/Bhavagad Gita).
Krishna continues His sermon, "He who, regardless of the fruit of actions, performs the actions which ought to be performed, is the devotee and renouncer; not he who discards the sacred fires, nor he who performs no acts.
[A person who performs an action which should be formed without regarding about the consequence (good or bad) of his actions is a devotee and a Yogi, NOT those who does not do any actions at all.
In another word, sitting down and meditating the whole day in hope of obtaining Moksha and doing all kind of stupid things just because you could do it is not a very clever thing to do. You going to do something, do it properly.]
Know, O son of Pandu, that what is called renunciation is spiritual discipline; for nobody becomes a man of discipline who has not renounced all fancies. To the sage who wishes to rise to spiritual discipline, action is said to be a means, and to him, when he has risen to spiritual discipline, tranquillity is said to be a means. When one does not attach one's self to objects of sense, nor to action, renouncing all fancies, then is one said to have risen to spiritual discipline.
[In order to obtain spiritual discipline, disattach yourself from fruits of your actions and do for sake of God and others, ONLY then you are someone who has spiritual discipline.]
A man should elevate his self by his self; he should not degrade his self, for even as a man's own self is his friend, a man's own self can also be his enemy. To him who has subjugated his self by his self, his self is a friend; but to him who has not restrained his self, his own self behaves like an enemy.
[My favorite verse actually. No one is your enemy, no one is your friend. You are your own friend (should you control your sensors) and you are your own foe (should you be controlled by your sensors).
For a Martial Artist like me, this means a lot because it is a proven verse in actual combat. If one controls his mind and his emotions from wondering, he is unbeatable.]
The self of one who has subjugated his self is tranquil and is absolutely concentrated on itself alone, in the midst of cold and heat, pleasure and pain, as well as honor and dishonor. The man of discipline whose self is contented with knowledge and experience, who is unmoved, who has restrained his senses, and to whom a clump of dirt, a stone, and gold are alike, is said to be spiritually disciplined. And he is esteemed highest who thinks alike about well-wishers, friends, and enemies, and those who are indifferent, and those who take both sides, and those who are objects of hatred, and relatives, as well as about the good and the sinful.
[A man who has spiritual discipline in him is unmoved by anything - heat or cold, pleasure or pain, honor or dishonor etc. He sees everything with equal perspective and his mind doesn't wonder with materialistic things and items.
A friend of mine (Christian actually) told me this just a few days ago - "A person who have sexual desires will try to get wealthy".
I asked him why and he said "Because sexual desires is one of the key needs of a human being. For that sake, he willing to endure any pains to get wealth. Once he has wealth, he will start spending it on Sexual objects and Sex, like so many things are unsatisfiable thus he is back in finding more wealth." ]
A man of discipline should constantly devote his self to abstraction, remaining in a secret place, alone, with his mind and self restrained, without expectations, and without belongings. Fixing his seat firmly in a clean place, not too high nor too low, and covered over with a sheet of cloth, a deer-skin, and blades of Kusa grass, and there seated on that seat, fixing his mind exclusively on one point, with the workings of the mind and senses restrained, he should practice discipline for purity of self. Holding his body, head, and neck even and unmoved, remaining steady, looking at the tip of his own nose, and not looking about in all directions, with a tranquil self, devoid of fear, and adhering to the rules of Brahmakarins, he should restrain his mind and concentrate it on me, and sit down engaged in devotion, regarding me as his final goal.
[Methods on how Hindus meditate.
Buddhist follow the same principles but they do not meditate on God or anything else, they meditate to let go of everything. Same as how others who accept Meditation does it for sake of the body.]
Thus constantly devoting his self to abstraction, a man of discipline whose mind is restrained attains that tranquillity which culminates in final emancipation and assimilation with me.
[A person who meditate upon Him will find tranquility and peace and finally returns back to Him.]
[Enough for now ...] |
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I rather performs some muslim errands than do this meditate. (my opinion only)
Not a day that all human beings didn抰 do any sins. So performs the errands which Muslim ought to be performed could make us a good Muslim while at the same time can deleted our small sins.
In Islam There r some ways that we could do to delete our small sins, eg. Sembahyang fardhu, sembahyang sunnat, sedekah, membaca zikir dan doa, buat amal bakti etc.
Sex is a part of human need. All human need it but Islam has a guide line how to do it in correct attention. This could create a healthy culture among us. I like to share a story here..
Seorg sahabat mendatangi Rasulullah saw lalu berkata: Saya tlh menciumi seorg wanita. Hukumlah saya menurut syariat Islam! Tetapi Rasulullah saw tidak memperdulikan ucapan org itu, sehingga sampailah waktu utk mendirikan sembahyang. Maka mereka pun sama2 mendirikan sembahyang.
Selesai sembahyang, org tadi bertanya sekali lagi. Lalu Rasulullah saw bertanya: 揃ukankah engkau tlh bersembahyang bersama2 kami tadi? Jawab org itu : 揃enar, wahai Rasulullah |
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by fleurzsa
I rather performs some muslim errands than do this meditate. (my opinion only)
That's why you are weak and we are not. ;) You choose what is easiest for you and call it faith.
Not a day that all human beings didn抰 do any sins. So performs the errands which Muslim ought to be performed could make us a good Muslim while at the same time can deleted our small sins.
In Islam There r some ways that we could do to delete our small sins, eg. Sembahyang fardhu, sembahyang sunnat, sedekah, membaca zikir dan doa, buat amal bakti etc.
Not a day pass when a human does some merit either.
Simple method - increase your merit and decrease your sins. When times comes, your merits will outshine your sins and you will be liberated. Only task you need know is to know which generate merit and which generate sins.
Sex is a part of human need. All human need it but Islam has a guide line how to do it in correct attention. This could create a healthy culture among us. I like to share a story here..
There is three basic needs for humans - Food, Sex, place of abode (living). Each of this has its own limitations and each of this can be controlled by Man by his own actions.
Food is a need of the body but too much food or too little will become a source of sickness. He needs to control what he eats, how much he eats and when he eats.
The need for living is a need for the body (as protection from the elements) but too much desire for this need will cause greedness and possession to worldly wealth (like having a big house with expensive things to show off to others) and too little will become a source of suffering (due to the elements or jealousy when one sees what other people has and he has none).
In the same way, same as Sex. Sex is simply an urge of the body due to the amount of hormones released within one's body. One can control this urges with physical conducts like martial arts (like me), Yoga, sports etc, which is why Buddhist countries like Japan, Thailand, Korea etc put such emphasis in sports, spiritual development and martial arts.
Even if one married with four wives, it doesn't mean that he will be happy or satisfy with it. WHY? Because sex is an urge which cannot be satisfied with sexual conducts, no matter how many wives one has.
And when one sees another pretty girl, what does he do? Does he says, "No, I'm satisfied with my wives and do not need more"? No, he will seeks to bring the pretty girl into his circle of wives as a tool to satisfy his sexual urge. His urge will satisfy for a moment but will begin again when he seeks another potential wives.
Even in the past, ONLY Princes in royal families in India choose polygamy. Regular people of India do not choose polygamy because of various problems which comes together with it like financial problems, time, etc.
Seorg sahabat mendatangi Rasulullah saw lalu berkata: Saya tlh menciumi seorg wanita. Hukumlah saya menurut syariat Islam! Tetapi Rasulullah saw tidak memperdulikan ucapan org itu, sehingga sampailah waktu utk mendirikan sembahyang. Maka mereka pun sama2 mendirikan sembahyang.
Selesai sembahyang, org tadi bertanya sekali lagi. Lalu Rasulullah saw bertanya: 揃ukankah engkau tlh bersembahyang bersama2 kami tadi? Jawab org itu : 揃enar, wahai Rasulullah |
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That's why you are weak and we are not. You choose what is easiest for you and call it faith.
Ha ha ha very funny |
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by fleurzsa
Ha ha ha very funny |
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Hmph ... Sekali pun belum pernah hadapi kematian, kamu nak besar2kan tugas2 remeh temeh macam jadi moderator.
"For someone who have yet to live a lifetime, you are quite bold" - Dracula, Dead and Loving it.
I have nothing to say |
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by fleurzsa
I have nothing to say |
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[Continue from where I have left off ...]
Discipline is not his, Arjuna, who eats too much, nor his who eats not at all; discipline is not his who is addicted to too much sleep, nor his who is always awake.
That spiritual discipline which destroys all suffering is his, who takes necessary food and exercise, who toils moderately in all necessary works, and who sleeps and wakes at the proper time.
[Straight forward ... eat and sleep moderately. Live a moderate life with all the moderate lifestyle. Such person is to be considered one with spiritual discipline.]
When a man's well-restrained mind becomes steady upon the self alone, then he being indifferent to all objects of desire, is said to be disciplined. As a light standing in a windless place flickers not, that is like the self of the man of discipline, whose mind is restrained, and who devotes his self to abstraction. That mental condition, in which the mind restrained by practice of abstraction, ceases to work, in which, one seeing the self by the self, is pleased in the self, in which one experiences that infinite happiness which transcends the senses and which can be grasped by the understanding only; and adhering to which, one never swerves from the truth, acquiring which, one thinks no other acquisition higher than it, and adhering to which, one is not shaken off even by great misery梩hat should be understood as spiritual discipline in which there is no experience of pain. That spiritual discipline should be practiced with steadiness and with an undespairing heart.
[A person when he is self-restrained will be indifferent toward desires and objects of desires. He will not dream of having millions, beautiful wives, big house or Paradise with 72 virgins ... ahem ... sorry about that.
Those without desires will not encounter misery and everything that comes to them, they will not effect them as much as the one who has desires. What comes, comes ... what goes, goes type of attitude.]
Abandoning, without exception, all desires, which are produced from fancies, and restraining the whole group of the senses on all sides by the mind only, one should by slow steps become tranquil with a firm resolve coupled with courage; and fixing his mind upon the self, should think of nothin.
Wherever the active and unsteady mind breaks forth, there one should ever restrain it, and fix it steadily on the self alone. The highest happiness comes to such a man of discipline, whose mind is fully tranquil, in whom the quality of passion has been suppressed, who is free from sin, and who is become one with the Brahman.
["He who has nothing, waits for nothing" - Gautama Buddha.
By abandoning all the desires of the Self and restraining the sensers of the body, one takes slow steps, with courage toward happiness. He will free himself from passion, sin and returns back to Brahman.]
Thus constantly devoting his self to abstraction, a man of discipline, freed from sin, easily obtains that supreme happiness梒ontact with the Brahman . He who has devoted his self to abstraction, by discipline, looking alike on everything, sees the self abiding in all beings, and all beings in the self. To him who sees me in everything, and everything in me, I am never lost, and he is not lost to me. The man of discipline who worships me abiding in all beings, holding that all is one, lives in me, however he may be living.
[Another difference between Abrahamic religion and Hindusm. In Abrahamic religion, God resides somewhere in heaven or above, and it is human's duty to reach Him. Such concept is why so many people lost sight of God and become lost.
In Hindusm, God is in you and in me and in everything around you. The seeds to reach spiritual progress is resides in everyone and those who develop it will see God in everything. To such person, God is not someone who abandon him to toil alone in the world, God is someone who always with him whether he remembers or not.
"I don't get it. Is there a God or not," - Doc "Bones" Mc Coy
"Perhaps God is not out there. Perhaps He is in here," - Captain Kirk, tapping his own chest where his heart is.
- Dialogue from Star Trek the Movie.
That man of discipline, Arjuna, is judged to be the best who looks alike on pleasure or pain, whatever it may be, in all creatures, comparing all with his own pleasure or pain.
[A sign of a person who is in path toward God and one who has fell away from it can be seen when a person compares other people's suffering by putting his own self in that place.
"What if it is I who was hit?" a Yogi will ask when he hits someone else and wonders about the pain. Same goes for words which is spoken, acts which was acted upon, things which was given etc.
A person who is away from path toward God WILL NOT be bothered about feeling of others because to him, others and him are not related. He sees himself as individual person and he alone as suffer or enjoyer of an action. Other people's sufferings isn't something he should be bothered with. ] |
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- Which one? The one which rationalize sex as something you need to satisfy when you know it cannot be satisfied?
Memanglah sex tu satu keperluan hidup tapi kita masih boleh hidup tanpa sex. 
- And WHO said I was going to get married?
So you will need more for this meditate action or maybe u will have to find whore.:hmm:
- Wrong ... you create your own paradise and your own hell. God don't condemn anyone, that is your misbeliefs brought by Abrahamic religions.
I don抰 want to quarrel with an ignorant (I mean in this subject)匸/b]
- Excepting Rahmat will make you weak and continue to live in life expecting something. That is why you see your own society always in need of something from others - monetary help, political supports etc. Weak minded people always expecting something.
Sabda Nabi saw,
擳idak dikira terus berdosa atas org yg tlh beristighfar (memohon ampun), meskipun ia mengulangi lagi dlm sehari sebanyak tujuh puluh kali. |
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- [Straight forward ... eat and sleep moderately. Live a moderate life with all the moderate lifestyle. Such person is to be considered one with spiritual discipline.]
Sabda Nabi saw,
揇i tengah2 umatku akan terdpt org2 yg makan berbagai macam makanan. Minum berbagai mcm minuman, memakai berbagai mcm pakaian, dan gemar mengumbar perbicaraan. Mereka ini adalah org2 yg paling buruk di kalangan umatku |
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by fleurzsa
Memanglah sex tu satu keperluan hidup tapi kita masih boleh hidup tanpa sex.
Is that so? How many prophets do you know which lived their lives without getting married, having kids and family? ;)
OK ... never mind about prophets. How many people in THIS WORLD, NOW and HERE, live their lives for Allah's sake if sex is not such an important aspects of your lives?
If you ask me, I could point out to plenty of Hindus and Buddhist, both monks and normal people who pushed aside the need for sex and reproduction for what they believe in.
So you will need more for this meditate action or maybe u will have to find whore.
Hmph ... Only reason I see why I must answer that question is if you are volunteering to be my partner for the night. ;)
Then again, I afraid my required qualifications for such mate is TOO HIGH for ANY Muslim ladies or men. ;) I simply don't accept commoners into my arms. ;)
Its mean as long the person who did sins plead for forgiveness from Allah SWT, he will be clear from the sins because Allah The Most Forgiveness.
How do you know that He will? Because your prophet said so?
Can you prove that your sins have been forgiven? No.
This not means that Muslim can do more sins but this is to motivate Muslim to ask for forgiveness on their sins.
For example, caring parents always forgive n forget on their children weakness.
Wrong ... a child who knows their parents will always forgive them will not change their stupid ways. They always continue their stupid acts and end up growing up as rascals and people with no manners.
That is why you see a lot of Malay child making so much noise in public places like the bus and LRT than non-Muslims. Because non-Muslims will give them a slap in the face if their children misbehave; it is their culture for not being rude. Such things do not happen with Malays.
Same way with you and your God. You will not change or improve because deep in you, you have this stupid notion that whatever you do, your God will always forgive you, as long as it is not the unforgiveable sin which is equalizing Him with some other God. |
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[I wanted to counter the post above but changed my mind. It is better if the readers themselves read and evaluate which is Truth and which is the Lie themselves.
Anyway, continue from where I have left of ... ]
Arjuna asked an important question, "I cannot see, O destroyer of Madhu, how to sustain this discipline by means of equanimity which you have declared, because, as I see it, humans are constantly changing their minds. For, Krishna, the mind is fickle, boisterous,, strong, and obstinate; and I think that to restrain it is as difficult as restraining the wind.
[Question is : How to control one's Mind when it is keep changing like the wind changes direction in the high seas?
PS : Madhu in also means something intoxicating and also the name of Liquor. I find it very odd that so many Indian couple willing to name their children Madhu (Intoxicating or Liqour).]
Krishna answers " Doubtless, O you of mighty arms, the mind is difficult to restrain, and fickle. Still, O son of Kunti, it may be restrained by constant practice and by indifference to worldly objects. It is my belief that spiritual discipline is hard to obtain for one who does not restrain his self. But by one who is self-restrained and assiduous, it can be obtained through proper means.
[And the answer - True that it is hard to control one's Mind. But according to Krishna, the spiritual discipline is hard to obtain by someone who is not able to restrain himself.]
[Note : Krishna DID NOT blame a person's falling out of spiritual discipline to any unseen forces like Syaitan or demons. Man have in his strenght to move forward by his own strenght and the reason for falling is himself ... not God, Karma, Syaitan or demons.]
Arjuna asked again, "What is the end of him, Krishna, who does not attain perfect spiritual discipline by not making enough effort, or having a mind shaken off from discipline, though full of faith? Does he, fallen from both paths, 8 go to ruin like a broken cloud, being, O you of mighty arms, without support, and deluded on the path leading to the Brahman? Be pleased, Krishna, to entirely destroy this doubt of mine, for none else than you can destroy this doubt. "
[Another good question ... what happens to those who are have failed to obtain this spiritual discipline during their life?]
O son of Pritha, neither in this world nor the next is ruin in store for him, because, dear friend, no-one who performs good deeds comes to an evil end. He who is fallen from discipline attains the worlds of those who perform meritorious acts, he dwells there for many years, and is afterwards born into a family of holy and illustrious men. Or he is even born into a family of talented men of discipline, for such a birth as that is more difficult to obtain. There he comes into contact with the knowledge which belonged to him in his former body, and then again, O descendant of Kuru, he works for perfection.
For even though he is reluctant, he is led away by the self-same former practice, and although he only wishes to learn discipline, he rises above the fruits of action laid down in the divine word. But the man of discipline, working with great efforts and cleared of his sins, attains perfection after many births, and then reaches the supreme goal.
The man of discipline is esteemed higher than the performers of penances, higher even than the men of knowledge, and the man of discipline is higher than the men of action; therefore, Arjuna, become a man of discipline. And even among all men of discipline, he who, being full of faith, worships me, with his inmost self intent on me, is esteemed by me to be the most disciplined.
[And the answer - Rebirth.
He will born again (whether his spirit or his soul, or maybe his self). He will regain the practises which he have partaken in his pervious life and he will relearn it again.
Same way a person who failed in a course have to resit for it another semester till he could past to the next semester.
This will continue to the higher "semester" till he finally graduates and return back to God. ]
Translated by Kashinath Trimbak Telano, 1882
Edited and annotated by Richard Hooker
[ Last edited by Sephiroth on 16-7-2004 at 02:58 PM ] |
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[OK ... continue now that no one is disturbing or asking questions. ]
Jnana Yoga
[Jnana means Knowledge. ]
Krishna continues His sermon, "O son of Pritha, now hear how you can without doubt know me fully, fixing your mind on me, and resting in me, and practicing discipline. I will now tell you exhaustively about knowledge together with experience; 1 that being known, there is nothing further left in this world to know.
Among thousands of men, only some work for perfection; and even of those who have reached perfection, and who are assiduous, only some know me truly.
[Something to remember ... not everyone can understand what God is, they can just imagine, believe or try to deduct by logic what/who God is.
So, becareful when someone comes and says "I have seen God and He has send me."]
I am earth, water, fire, air, space, mind, understanding, and individuality梞y nature is divided into these eight parts. But this is a lower form of my nature. Know that there is another form of my nature, and higher than this, which is animate and by which this universe is upheld. Know that all things have these for their source. I am the producer and the destroyer of the whole universe There is nothing else higher than myself; all this universe is woven upon me, like numbers of pearls upon a thread. I am the taste in water, I am the light of the sun and moon, I am 'Om' in all the Vedas, sound in space, and manliness in human beings; I am the fragrant smell in the earth, the light in the fire; I am life in all beings, and penance in those who perform penance.
[I think this is straight forward and do not need to be explained.
However, I couldn't help but to wonder whether studies of Gita is the source for Karbalah which become part of Jewish tradition later in Middle East. ]
Know me, O son of Pritha, to be the eternal seed of all beings; I am the discernment of the discerning ones, and I am the greatness of the great. I am also the strength, unaccompanied by fondness or desire, of the strong. And, O chief of the descendants of Bharata, I am the love which is unopposed to devotion among all beings.
And all entities which are of the quality of goodness, and those which are of the quality of passion and of darkness, 4 know that they are, indeed, all from me; I am not in them, but they are in me.
[What you should remember is the last sentence - "they are from me, I am not in them but they are in me." ]
The whole universe, deluded by these three states of mind, developed from the qualities and does not know me who am beyond them and inexhaustible; for this delusion of mine, developed from the qualities, is divine and difficult to transcend. Only those who resort to me transcend this delusion. Wicked men, evil-doers, who are deluded, who are deprived of their knowledge by this delusion, and who incline to the demonic state of mind, do not resort to me. But, Arjuna, doers of good acts of all four classes worship me: one who is distressed, one who is seeking after knowledge, one who wants wealth, and one, O chief of the descendants of Bharata, who is possessed of knowledge.
[This whole Universe is somewhat a illusions of sensors. They are real but what is real is trully depends on the Mind.
Two men - one is greedy and one is wise. The greedy person will look at jewels as something real and important while the wise one will look at it as stones from the Earth. The jewels itself is REAL but each person looks and define it in their own sense of understanding and reality (based on their Self).
Who worship Him? Those who seeks Him in distress, those who seeks (worldly) knowledge (I guess that could count Atheist since they seeks to understand whether God is around or not but studying the World around them), those who want wealth (and other materialistic possession, YES, that should include heavenly delights) and finally, those who HAS knowledge (of Him).]
Of these, he who is possessed of knowledge, who is always disciplined, and whose worship is addressed to one Being only, is esteemed highest. For to the man of knowledge I am dear above all things, and he is dear to me.
All these four classes are noble. But the man possessed of knowledge is deemed by me to be my own self. For he with his self devoted to abstraction, has taken to me as the goal than which there is nothing higher.
[Of all that worship Him, those who HAS knowledge is deemed the noblest because they put Him as goal of their lives. ] |
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Im back..:bgrin:
I have nothing to say now...
To tell u the truth.... i dont think i like this God Song...
But i will still reading.. okay..:nerd:
[ Last edited by fleurzsa on 19-7-2004 at 07:49 AM ] |
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by fleurzsa
I have nothing to say now...
To tell u the truth.... i dont think i like this God Song...
But i will still reading.. okay..
Hmph ... forgive me if I said I didn't notice you have gone. ;)
And HOW many God's Songs do you know?
Sounds like you have been listening to Man's singing of God so much that you can't differentiate between Man's Song and God's Song. |
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Originally posted by Sephiroth at 19-7-2004 10:26 AM:
by fleurzsa
I have nothing to say now...
To tell u the truth.... i dont think i like this God Song...
But i will still reading.. okay..
Hmph ... forgive me if I said I didn't ...
Its okay if u didn抰 notice me...:bgrin:
But as a learner i will follow this thread till the end..
Maybe I had used the wrong words..:stp:
These all r about Hinduism poems, especially for Dewa Krishna, isn抰 it?:hmm: |
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Post time 8-7-2004 11:38 AM
Author
