Stoning of She Monkey In Hadiths

MENJ

Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 2004-4-13 06:32 AM:

:hmm:
Maltreatment of animal...
What about DOGS.
Why so much superstition abt dogs in Islam? Did Muhammad have give the order to kill dogs?

ref...





[/f ...

This hadith regarding the killing of dogs will soon be featured in bismikaAllahuma.org. Suffice to say that the order for the killing of dogs is because of the prevailing rabies during that time in Madinah, and not a fixed rule.

- MENJ

Debmey

No rabies mentioned in the hadiths. Besides, Mo soecifically callled dogs eveil, especially black ones? so are yu gonna say that the dogs around Medina were evil then and nopt eveil now? Are yu gonna say that rabies like black dogs more? Hhahahahahahahahaha.....................

Seraphim

I've asked before in muslim board before about "Why Muslim can't touch dogs"...There are good replies however there are really stupid ones too....

Debmey

Menj would do well to explain the hadith about stoning of she monkey first.
Upon examination, his posts did not even deal with teh points brought up by me.

cheers

MENJ

Originally posted by Debmey at 2004-4-19 03:18 PM:
Menj would do well to explain the hadith about stoning of she monkey first.
Upon examination, his posts did not even deal with teh points brought up by me.

Here's a message for Debmey @ SFE @ the Moron of Singapore:



- MENJ

Debmey

Thats a picture of a mujahideen, a muslim warrior in Afghanistan oppressing an innocent man.

peace

Debmey

Finally Menj and all muslims still fail to defend the silly story of the stoning of she monkey as described in the hadith.

cheers

kid

Originally posted by Debmey at 19-4-2004 03:08 PM:
No rabies mentioned in the hadiths. Besides, Mo soecifically callled dogs eveil, especially black ones? so are yu gonna say that the dogs around Medina were evil then and nopt eveil now? Are yu gon ...

The order to kill dogs because there was a disease... later on prophet allowed keeping dogs as guard to property.

FaithHealer3

Originally posted by MENJ at 2004-4-19 02:15 PM:
This hadith regarding the killing of dogs will soon be featured in bismikaAllahuma.org. Suffice to say that the order for the killing of dogs is because of the prevailing rabies during that  ...

Before you write another article, how abt answering the question i posted in your forum abt the article abt :dia: AISHA.

I am only asking for the reference to your CLAIM. You claimed this...    `耰shah(R) was betrothed (zawaj) at the age of 6 years old and the marriage was consummated (nik鈎) a few years after the marriage at 9 years old when she was in full puberty.

How did you know for sure that she was in full puberty when she was only 9years old? :hmm:

MENJ, The link to the forum on your main page is obscure lah.

MENJ

Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 2004-4-20 02:14 AM:

Before you write another article, how abt answering the question i posted in your forum abt the article abt :dia: [url=http://www.bismikaAllahuma.org/Polemics/aishah.htm] A ...

Give me the link to the post you made at my forum. Surely you don't expect me to comb through 2000+ posts just to find your message, do you?

As for your question about how it is determined that Aishah was mature enough at nine, the answer is the biological process takes its natural course to determine adulthood.

- MENJ

MENJ

Originally posted by Debmey at 2004-4-19 03:08 PM:
No rabies mentioned in the hadiths. Besides, Mo soecifically callled dogs eveil, especially black ones? so are yu gonna say that the dogs around Medina were evil then and nopt eveil now? Are yu gon ...

Once the article is rolled out, I am sure your heckling would just be noises that we can all ignore :nana::nana: Until then, be patient like everyone else and WAIT for it.

- MENJ

Debmey

Your logic concerning the rabies in dogs don't measure up.
The hadiths said only gurad dogs and shepard dogs were to be kept, not non diseased dogs, in other words, the discrimination was against dogs and not rabies.

MENJ

Originally posted by Debmey at 2004-4-20 09:50 AM:
Your logic concerning the rabies in dogs don't measure up.
The hadiths said only gurad dogs and shepard dogs were to be kept, not non diseased dogs, in other words, the discrimination was against  ...

Dr. G.F. Haddad's answer:

>Book 010, Number 3811:  
>Abdullah (b. Umar) (Allah be pleased with them)
>reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him)
>ordered the killing of dogs and we would send (men)
>in Medina and its corners and we did not spare any
>dog that we did not kill, so much so that we killed
>the dog that accompanied the wet she-camel
>belonging to the people of the desert.

This is from Sahih Muslim, in a chapter titled:
Chapter 31: COMMAND OF KILLING DOGS AND THEN ITS
ABROGATION, AND PROHIBITION OF KEEPING THEM BUT
FOR HUNTING AND PROTECTION OF LANDS OR CATTLE OR LIKE THAT.

Ibn `Umar in al-Bukhari also narrated that dogs would
enter mosques freely and urinate in them.

It is possible that a temporary rabies problem took
place, or some other disease using dogs as carriers,
or a dog overpopulation problem. In the West, dogs
have been "put to sleep" since forever.

(Source)

- MENJ

Debmey

Exactly. The hadith never mentioned any diseases. Dogs were only kept for guard and sheparding. Mo even mentioned that dogs have demons.

The discrimination is clearly against dogs and not against rabies.
Even today, Muslismdon't keeop dogs because of what Mo said.

FaithHealer3

Originally posted by MENJ at 2004-4-20 09:41 AM:
Give me the link to the post you made at my forum. Surely you don't expect me to comb through 2000+ posts just to find your message, do you?

MENJ,
Its in this tread :dia: Muhammad PBUH and Aisha PBUher.

Help your friend TimurKhan there, he tries but still he can't defend your article there.

Originally posted by MENJ at 2004-4-20 09:41 AM:
As for your question about how it is determined that Aishah was mature enough at nine, the answer is the biological process takes its natural course to determine adulthood.

Don't we know that. But how do you know for sure that Aisha was in full puberty. as you claim in your article.

Here is abit of info abt puberty from Puberty 101.com

Five Stages of Puberty - Girls
   
1  Age Range: Usually 8-11
In Stage 1 there are no outside signs of development, but a girl's ovaries are enlarging and hormone production is beginning.
   
2  Age Range: Usually 8-14. Average: 11-12
The first sign is typically the beginning of breast growth, including "breast buds." A girl may also grow considerable height and weight. The first signs of pubic hair start out fine and straight, rather than curly.  
   
3  Age Range: Usually 9-15. Average: 12-13
Breast growth continues, and pubic hair coarsens and becomes darker, but there still isn't a lot of it. Your body is still growing, and your vagina is enlarging and may begin to produce a clear or whitish discharge, which is a normal self-cleansing process. Some girls get their first menstrual periods late in this stage.
   
4  Age Range: Usually 10-16. Average: 13-14
Pubic hair growth takes on the triangular shape of adulthood, but doesn't quite cover the entire area. Underarm hair is likely to appear in this stage, as is menarche. Ovulation (release of egg cells) begins in some girls, but typically not in a regular monthly routine until Stage 5.
   
5  Age Range: Usually 12-19. Average: 15
This is the final stage of development, when a girl is physically an adult. Breast and pubic hair growth are complete, and your full height is usually attained by this point. Menstrual periods are well established, and ovulation occurs monthly.

So how do you know for sure that Aisha had already reached her puberty at 9years old BEFORE Muhammad consummated his marriage with her? :hmm:

MENJ

Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 2004-4-20 09:53 PM:



MENJ,
Its in this tread :dia: Muhammad PBUH and Aisha PBUher.

Help your friend Tim ...

So you have registered at bismikaAllahuma.org forum. Well,you are most welcomed to stay there, as long as decorum and civility is maintained. I hope more Cari members will join the forum soon.

As for your query on puberty, the link is limited in scope to Western women. It is certainly not applicable to women living 1400 ago in the Semitic context. Marriage at the early years of puberty was acceptable in 7th century Arabia as it was the social norm in all Semitic cultures from the Israelites to the Arabs and all nations in between. According to H

FaithHealer3

Originally posted by MENJ at 2004-4-22 04:34 PM:
So you have registered at bismikaAllahuma.org forum. Well,you are most welcomed to stay there, as long as decorum and civility is maintained. I hope more Cari members will join the forum soon.

I went to your website because of MURTAD MAMA... i was wondering what was the hype... why you were slandering her and why you got banned from Faithfreedom.org.
It was actually...  much ado about nothing.

Originally posted by MENJ at 2004-4-22 04:34 PM:
As for your query on puberty, the link is limited in scope to Western women. It is certainly not applicable to women living 1400 ago in the Semitic context. Marriage at the early years of puberty was acceptable in 7th century Arabia as it was the social norm in all Semitic cultures from the Israelites to the Arabs and all nations in between.

Thats right. 1400 year old customs are not applicable in todays modern living.
Modern law protect young girls from being abused. Perverts exist even in modern society... child-prono is doing well. But modern law teaches us that it is wrong. Medical science show that young childrens are not suitable for sex, it damages the growing child. When you see a 6 year old child you don't think of them as sexual object.

[quote]Originally posted by MENJ at 2004-4-22 04:34 PM:
According to H

ibnur

Originally posted by Debmey at 2004-4-3 00:57:
A few natural questions to be raised.

1. how did the sahabi know about the crime?
2. Did he talk to the monkeys?
3. Was he gifted enough with the ability of talking to animals?
4. Where was ...

Sahabi words!  Who cares?  

U should realise that the 'hadith' got nothing to do with Prophet Muhammad.

Debmey

The hadiths are the deeds of Mo, don't you know?

ibnur

Originally posted by Debmey at 2004-4-23 08:34:
The hadiths are the deeds of Mo, don't you know?

Sah頷 al-Bukh鈘