The root of all evil

Agul

Mmm, how to elaborate?

The self as in ego self, the small, limited us. The Self as in our higher aspect.

Our true self could be the spirit that reside in this body. Which uses the body as a vehicle. Honestly there are different opinion on this, depending on where you're coming from, religious, scientific backgrond and personal experience.

So we are basically nice, essentially but the small self, the ego self feels so small and limited that many feel the need to agflap(apathy, grief fear, lust, anger, pride each other, to control or to get approval from them.

ReuK

Punca kejahatan ialah nafsu

Nafsu yg tidak dikawal akan meraja diri

Nafsu telah dibakar selama beribu tahun tapi tetap megah berdiri
Hanya kelaparan saja yg boleh menundukkan nafsu

Menurut Rabiatul Adawiyah:
Nafsu perempuan itu 9 dan nafsu lelaki itu 1

Sekadar pendapatan aku

hamizao

Menurut Rabiatul Adawiyah:
Nafsu perempuan itu 9 dan nafsu lelaki itu 1

Depends how you look at things, really..........

To some.....the 9 sounds waaaah...teruknye! Strangely......yang 1 tu can be the source of many, many unhappiness!  Would yo say that the evil lurks there more?

Neraka Bulan

Some say religions are the root of all evil(Richard Dawkins)..What say you??

Agul

Religion is a touchy subject for most people as most people feel a need to defend their belief and want to make sure the other person have the same understanding as him/her exactly..

However the concept of sin are introduced by religion, right?

hamizao

However the concept of sin are introduced by religion, right?

Not absolutely I might say. Studies have shown that if people do things together the brain would react differently. By and by people would be able to work out their own moral codes.

Agul

And these moral codes becomes religion, right?

All these millennia programming becomes embedded in the system and they evolve.

ajinomotonosuga

Originally posted by hamizao at 18-6-2008 01:04 AM
If I might throw my thoughts a bit, firstly, evil seems to exist in the human world and not animal. Why?

animals has less capability to imagine...

ajinomotonosuga

Originally posted by my-alja at 19-6-2008 02:33 PM



i rasa sebab human can talk and animal cannot talk
let say animal can talk...i think a cow would label the wolf is more evil than a duck

dun take it literally k

animals , even plants pun boleh ketawa dan menangis, they do COMMUNICATE with each other, cuma depa tak komunikasi macam seperti manusia komunikasi bahasa arab dengan manusia lain

manusia ada animals instinct..tapi animals tokleh ada human instinct sampai ada civilisation due to lack of IMAGINATION..

depa punye akal is read only memory(ROM), tapi manusia ada RAM(randam access memory)and ROM.

RAM is conscious mind, manakala ROM is subconscious mind to human intelligence (CPU)

ajinomotonosuga

Originally posted by Agul at 19-6-2008 02:02 PM
Depend on who you ask.

Maybe it's our deviation from our true Self? Not self, but Self.

show me where the Self nih ? if u cannot show it to  me........i can show it to u

ajinomotonosuga

Originally posted by hamizao at 18-6-2008 11:24 PM
What is this thing we call evil?

the things human cannot control..the things u cannot grasp the control of it.. u will 'imagine' there is some evil about it

fear and self control..goes together

so u need FAITH along the way and this give rise to the term religion

ajinomotonosuga

Originally posted by Agul at 19-6-2008 07:27 PM
By letting go of inner insecurities. One should not stake securities on outside things, people, or events as this can always change in any moment. It really takes a very extensive work to do this ...

tak abis abis cite letting go ko ni laa agul..letting go laa..releasing laa..cakap je la freedom kan senang

ajinomotonosuga

Originally posted by Agul at 20-6-2008 02:37 PM
Mmm, how to elaborate?

The self as in ego self, the small, limited us. The Self as in our higher aspect.

Our true self could be the spirit that reside in this body. Which uses the body as  ...

the bulls.. in psyschoanalysis ....Freud the wanker, super id laa, oedipus complex laaaa..ego id la..Adler lagi make sense tau

ajinomotonosuga

Originally posted by ReuK at 20-6-2008 05:02 PM
Punca kejahatan ialah nafsu

Nafsu yg tidak dikawal akan meraja diri

Nafsu telah dibakar selama beribu tahun tapi tetap megah berdiri
Hanya kelaparan saja yg boleh menundukkan nafsu

Menu ...

zaman ni ramai oang gemok2 la..esp di western

tu petanda nafsu tidak terkawal ke?

ko tenguk ada program Who is the biggest loser tu....gemok2

kelaparan cuma mengekang napsu tapi yang tundukkan nafsu to me ialah bila manusia betui2 takutkan ALLAH swt, pencipta depa..

the FEAR towards our creatoer must be the primary to everything we do in life. kita cuma hamba, cuba imagine camna hamba dengan tuan..ini bukan sebarang tuan..nak kenal tuan ni pi baca kitab quran dan faham semua nya, pi baca dan faham apa tu asma alhusna, kita baru tenguk tsunami dah gerunnnnnn...cuba kita bayangkan banjir besar zaman nabi Nuh a.s., macam mana  agaknya banding dengan tsunami sampai beratus ribu manusia mati..napa kita tak gerun or takutttttt?

sebab hati kita kotor. hitam berdaki..penuh dosa macam2. tuhan campak nur pun tak nyala..sebab hitam sangat, tuhan kene campak banyak tapi dia tak leh kasik sebab kita buat amal soleh sikit saja..nak banyak nur buat lah amal soleh banyak2, ikhlas baru dapat banyak kan? But kalo hati kita bersih putih macam cermin berkilat2, dia campak skit jer..terang sampai menyilau2 orang lain..orang lain boleh nampak aaaaaaaaa btui dak?

so apa yang gelapkan hati manusia tu? haaa itu kene selidik la nanti jadik kutbah jemaat, agul marah2 aku plak kang :victory:

ajinomotonosuga

Originally posted by Neraka Bulan at 21-6-2008 12:30 PM
Some say religions are the root of all evil(Richard Dawkins)..What say you??

the late Richard Dawkins ni soang biologist, lebih tepat dia ni genetist. Dia ni atheist. Pendokong kuat segalanya ada kaitan genes or keje2 genetic.

to me paling sempoi maksud religion ialah kepercayaan, or the belief. But to most bila sebut pasal religion, di kaitkan isu monotheism and polytheism seme tu, soal2 theology, ketuhanan , keagamaan, pendewaan, penyembahan etc.

atheist percaya walo brain is limited but thru age of time the brain boleh expand dan oleh itu semua masalah yang masa kini tak diketahui jawapan, AKAN DATANG nanti pasti dapat jawapan nya disebabkan NATURE  brain

of course it makes sense, kalo sapa ada akal, memang masuk akal pun statement macam tu, so atheist kata why bother things cannot yet be proved, we stick to pekara2 kita boleh experiment and deduced something dari nya (scientific macam genetic)

so buat apa religion ni semua? mengajak manusia berfikir dan percaya pekara2 yang tidak terbukti oleh experimen secara saintifik, contoh macam isu percaya malaikat malaikat tuh. Kan lebih baik be praktikal be realisitc, dari percaya malaikat tulis dosa dan pahala setiap saat?

cuba fikir, kalo tak pecahkan ruyung, kita tak dapat sagu, in order to live peacefully sometime u have to kill, survival of the fittest, yang lemah akan pupus, semua akan carik GENES yang kuat dan boleh sambung kehidupan tapi agama or religion larang membunuh, larang buat silap, larang itu ini menjadikan manusia itu tidak boleh merealisasikan potensi kemanusiaan dia yang sebenar, the bestest intelligence amongs all intelligence in this world.

so to say religion is the root of all evil pun kekadang tepat pada CONTEXT yang di bincangkan. bila mana kita tau apa oang itu PERCAYA sangat2 merugikan diri nya, masarakat nya dan dunia seluruh nya.

u all tau tak, arwah King Malik Al faisal..saya maybe silap nama ni but al faisal tu btui la..u all can check further..dia ni King Saudi in mid 70s tak salah saya, mati dibunuh oleh anak sedara dia sendiri..kene tembak sebab apa? Sebab dia nak modernisekan Saudi , nak suruh azan di laungkan DI RADIO, tapi adik dia tak setuju, depa ni kira 'puritan' islam di mecca, adik dia ni kene tembak oleh pegawai polis tidak sengaja masa buat demo menentang cadangan AL faisal, so anak sedara dia yakni anak pada adik dia tu..balas dendam dan bunuh pakcik sendiri..in all i can say it is about to bring changes in Saudi oleh arwah al faisal yang sebabkan pertumpahan darah ni.

of course banyak isu religion boleh di politikkan, dan itu sudah lama berlaku even di Malaysia. In all, we have to look at what context , things are said , so kita tau apa sebenar mahu di perkatakan.

hamizao

And these moral codes becomes religion, right?

In some cases...An atheist does not necessarily be without any moral. Most say they just don't like to be dogmatic.

Agul

Originally posted by ajinomotonosuga at 22-6-2008 03:09 AM


show me where the Self nih ? if u cannot show it to牋me........i can show it to u

Where do you want to go?

I think it's right where you are.

However, experientally, I don't know it yet. Intellectually, I suppose so.

hamizao

aji:

Originally posted by ajinomotonosuga at 22-6-2008 03:02 AM
animals has less capability to imagine...

May be so but does it means that evil is the biproduct of man's imagination....his more that fully sophont nature?

my-alja:

i rasa sebab human can talk and animal cannot talk
let say animal can talk...i think a cow would label the wolf is more evil than a duck

I don't really know whether there is an equivalent to the word 'evil' or deed that it is in the animal kingdom. we accept, say, survival  of the fittest being part of animal being/nature. Yet, time and again human resort to similar instinct to resolve deadlocks. Some say it is evil instead.... it depends who is victorious.

If we go back to the hunter-gatherer times, survival of the tribe -cooperation and mutual reliance- was of paramount importance . Anyone contravening it's codes was severely punished. In ancient Arabia and Israel they faced banishment from the tribe to survive in the desert - usually a swift route to death at that time. To day many would not understand it and would even think it cruel.

[ Last edited by  hamizao at 22-6-2008 05:52 PM ]

Agul

Originally posted by ajinomotonosuga at 22-6-2008 03:14 AM


tak abis abis cite letting go ko ni laa agul..letting go laa..releasing laa..cakap je la freedom kan senang

meh, aji,

Letting go, or releasing is needed first since most people don't really want freedom.燚o you know any better way?

Now, how could  I want freedom? How do I increase my desire for freedom?

Agul

Originally posted by ajinomotonosuga at 22-6-2008 03:16 AM


the bulls.. in psyschoanalysis ....Freud the wanker, super id laa, oedipus complex laaaa..ego id la..Adler lagi make sense tau

I think real Self cannot be explained. Just experienced. Till I experience it myself, its just a nice theory.