Buddhist beheaded by moslem-fanatics in Southern Thai

Feeling oppressed, poverty, poor relation with central government are all inane epithet string together to make one worthless argument!

Poverty because they are mentally poor! Poor relation because they have poor attitude! Blame no one. If Kelantanese are poor for not working hard enough & failed to tackle their own corruption, I guess they can blame our central government & gain independence & went on to believe in fantasies that they will become rich there after forever...

:blah:

vixen

Gapodio wrote:
If it is done by Muslim it is against the Islamic  values that I learn and I condemn the action.

mmm..why do say the act is unislamic? Isn't this part of Jeehad? Killing an infidel?

Originally posted by Adm_Cheng_Ho at 2004-6-2 11:32 AM:
Feeling oppressed, poverty, poor relation with central government are all inane epithet string together to make one worthless argument!

Poverty because they are mentally poor! Poor relation beca ...

The Pattani problem is not a religious problem. Its more a racial & economic problem. They have been neglected, yes. They are not very hard working, also yes. Something has to be done constructively, yes. Irresponsible elements (using Islam as a tool to stir emotion) are also at work, yes.  Irresponsible/narrow minded non-Muslim factions have also taken this opportunity to bash Islam, yes. In a country like Thailand, where, overall, most people are simple minded and not as sophisticated, especially in the south (whatever their religion), things can get worse if the government does not tackle it with tact.  

Debmey

To be contructive, for a start, decent people, especially Muslims need to condemn those terrorists strongly and start weeding them out from the community.

And stop linking terrorism to whatever injustice whatsover. There is simply no justification for terrorism.

The truth is, many areas in Thailand are much less developed, and the people there naver talked about seperatism nor commit any violence. Why only the Muslim areas?

Originally posted by vixen at 2004-6-2 11:42 AM:

mmm..why do say the act is unislamic? Isn't this part of Jeehad? Killing an infidel?

Defending your right is Jihad.

Killing infidels with no valid reason permitted by Islam is not Jihad .....

BTW where do you get the idea that Killing infidel is a Jihad to muslim? .....

Originally posted by Debmey at 2004-6-2 12:30 PM:
To be contructive, for a start, decent people, especially Muslims need to condemn those terrorists strongly and start weeding them out from the community.

And stop linking terrorism to w ...

Get some historical background first before blasting out what your heart wants to blast,  without the proper basis.

Read whats in the url below, especially under "Greater Patani State /Negara Patani Raya". It is also a nationalistic endeavour. This is where the problem started ~ historical. The people must be made to feel more Thai and at the same without foresaking Islam. Its easier said than done.

"atani was an ancient and independent Malay state before it was conquered by Thais in 1795-96. Originally, Thais divided Patani into seven sultanates with some measure of local autonomy before final annexation in 1902. During the Second World War, while Thailand was siding with Japan, and Japanese troops present in Malaya and Southern Thailand, one of the Patani princes, Tun Mahmud Mahyuddin, was collaborating militarily with the British and was promised the restoration of Patani independence after allied victory. That promise given to the Greater Patani Malays' Movement was never kept and Thai presence was reestablished giving cause to numerous liberation movements in the area. The flag flown in this period of history was the national flag of the Negara Patani Raya or Greater Patani State."


http://fotw.vexillum.com/flags/th%7dpulo.html

[ Last edited by KENNKID on 2-6-2004 at 12:56 PM ]

Historically, Pattani used to be a semi-independent Malay kingdom, but part of the Thai kingdoms of Sukhothai and Ayuthaya. After the fall of Atuthaya in 1767, Pattani gained full independence. Under King Rama 1, it became part of Thailand again. 1909, it was annexed by Kingdom of Siam as part of a treaty negotiated with the British Empire.

Sephiroth

ff:

Anyone know what the history lesson here have to do about a man who's head got chopped off? Stick to the topic, pls. You guys ain't the UN. ;)

Seraphim

Originally posted by Sephiroth at 2-6-2004 01:18 PM:
ff:

Anyone know what the history lesson here have to do about a man who's head got chopped off? Stick to the topic, pls. You guys ain't the UN. ;)

It's a very simple logic.You see....everyone can yap all the want about this being a political motivated action or whatever.However these troublemalkers is making trouble and spreading it to the religion root.What i can see here is,they want to create havoc especially concerning religion.What's fitting for these bunch of people?They want to kill innocent people especially Buddhists then be prepared to get kill brutally as if i care.I really can place a bet,that after some time when the Thailand government take serious measures,you going to see some Thai Muslims people crying because the government "opress" them.:lebai:

Originally posted by Seraphim at 2004-6-2 03:50 PM:


It's a very simple logic.You see....everyone can yap all the want about this being a political motivated action or whatever.However these troublemalkers is making trouble and spreading it to the religion root.What i can see here is,they want to create havoc especially concerning religion.What's fitting for these bunch of people?They want to kill innocent people especially Buddhists then be prepared to get kill brutally as if i care.I really can place a bet,that after some time when the Thailand government take serious measures,you going to see some Thai Muslims people crying because the government "opress" them.

I see you are no different than those "bunch of PPL" that  you refer to. You'll do the same if you are in their situation ..... oh sorry I forget that actually no muslim get killed there ..

Seraphim

Originally posted by Gapodio at 2-6-2004 04:00 PM:


I see you are no different than those "bunch of PPL" that  you refer to. You'll do the same if you are in their situation ..... oh sorry I forget that actually no muslim get killed th ...

I wont be doing the killing so i wont be among that "bunch of people" And stop picking teeny weeny statement out of people's post and try to rebuke .. thank you

[ Last edited by Seraphim on 2-6-2004 at 04:13 PM ]

vixen

Gapodio wrote:
...
Killing infidels with no valid reason permitted by Islam is not Jihad .....
BTW where do you get the idea that Killing infidel is a Jihad to muslim? .....

In other words,Islam does permit slaughtering of infidels if there is a "valid" reason or a moral-justification?

I seem to get my idea of what Jeehad is from this:

(Muhammad)047.004 : Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks;At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them): thereafter (is the time for) either generosity or ransom: Until the war lays down its burdens. Thus (are ye commanded): but if it had been Allah's Will, He could certainly have exacted retribution from them (Himself); but (He lets you fight) in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the Way of Allah,- He will never let their deeds be lost.

Smite at their necks? Excuse my ignorance,but if it doesn't teach how to slain an infidel,then what do you make out of the quranic verse then?

[ Last edited by vixen on 2-6-2004 at 04:56 PM ]

Sephiroth

by Seraphim

It's a very simple logic.You see....everyone can yap all the want about this being a political motivated action or whatever.However these troublemalkers is making trouble and spreading it to the religion root.What i can see here is,they want to create havoc especially concerning religion.What's fitting for these bunch of people?They want to kill innocent people especially Buddhists then be prepared to get kill brutally as if i care.I really can place a bet,that after some time when the Thailand government take serious measures,you going to see some Thai Muslims people crying because the government "opress" them.  

Which is why I stop bothering with issues like Isreal-Palestine, Iraq, Philiphines and now Thai.

Originally posted by vixen at 2004-6-2 04:46 PM:

other words,Islam does permit slaughtering of infidels if there is a "valid" reason or a moral-justification?

I seem to get my idea of what Jeehad is from this:

(Muhammad)047.004 : Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks;At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them): thereafter (is the time for) either generosity or ransom: Until the war lays down its burdens. Thus (are ye commanded): but if it had been Allah's Will, He could certainly have exacted retribution from them (Himself); but (He lets you fight) in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the Way of Allah,- He will never let their deeds be lost.

Smite at their necks? Excuse my ignorance,but if it doesn't teach how to slain an infidel,then what do you make out of the quranic verse then?

Yes Islam permit slaughtering of Infidel as well as other muslim in a certain situation such as
  - War
  - Punishment for their wrong doing (Hudud law?)
  - ......

As for the verses up there .... it is describing the situation in a war (dont tell me you just shoot your enemy at the toe during war. Or just cut the finger if you use sword?). Well I don't want to get too deep into it but if you really want to truly understand the meaning if it just look at the whole verse (including few more paragraph before and after) or read the book that explain the meaning of that verse.

What I know, Islam required muslim to treat their non muslim neighbour same way with their muslim neighbour. If you have a wrong perspective than go and get the right perspective abt Islamic teachings.

[ Last edited by Gapodio on 2-6-2004 at 05:50 PM ]

Debmey

There is just no justification whatsover for terrorism.
Terrorism is a crime and those people who behead the monk are criminals. Period.

vixen

He wasn't even a monk.Just a poor 67-year old rubber plantation worker.

Debmey

What glory is there in beheading an innocent old man?

Originally posted by Debmey at 2004-6-2 07:58 PM:
There is just no justification whatsover for terrorism.
Terrorism is a crime and those people who behead the monk are criminals. Period.

I agree .... it is a criminal.

Originally posted by Debmey at 2004-6-2 09:44 PM:
What glory is there in beheading an innocent old man?

Agree ... what glory?.

And what glory killing kids throwing stone?

And What glory killing PPL attending Wedding Ceremony?

And ....

Seraphim

Originally posted by Gapodio at 3-6-2004 07:25 AM:


Agree ... what glory?.

And what glory killing kids throwing stone?

And What glory killing PPL attending Wedding Ceremony?

And ....

There's no glory for the kids who threw stones to people with assault rifles just because their parents or elders dont take care of them....
There's no glory to have a wedding party in the middle of the war zone and firing AK-47s in the sky just to celebrate the wedding ...

[ Last edited by Seraphim on 3-6-2004 at 07:37 AM ]